Public Accounts Committee


Meeting Venue:

Committee Room 3 - Senedd




Meeting date:

Tuesday, 10 March 2015




Meeting time:

09.06 - 10.54




This meeting can be viewed on Senedd TV at:



Concise Minutes:




Assembly Members:


Darren Millar AM (Chair)

Jocelyn Davies AM

William Graham AM

Mike Hedges AM

Sandy Mewies AM

Julie Morgan AM

Jenny Rathbone AM

Aled Roberts AM








Huw Vaughan Thomas, Auditor General for Wales, Wales Audit Office

Matthew Mortlock, Wales Audit Office

Steve Ashcroft, Wales Audit Office

Mark Jeffs, Wales Audit Office

Dave Thomas, Wales Audit Office

Sir Derek Jones, Permanent Secretary, Welsh Government

David Richards, Welsh Government

Gawain Evans, Welsh Government

Peter Ryland, Welsh Government






Committee Staff:


Michael Kay (Clerk)

Leanne Hatcher (Second Clerk)

Tanwen Summers (Deputy Clerk)






View the meeting transcript.



1   Introductions, apologies and substitutions

1.1        The Chair welcomed Members to the meeting.


1.2     There were no apologies.




2   Papers to note

2.1     The papers were noted.


2.2     The Committee agreed to write to the Minister for Education and Skills to request a clear timetable of actions against its recommendations on Covering Teachers’ Absence.




3   Welsh Government Annual Report on Grants Management 2014: Evidence session 1

3.1     The Committee scrutinised the Welsh Government on its Annual Report on Grants Management.


3.2     The Welsh Government agreed to provide a note on:

·         the potential losses that are outstanding as a result of organisations that are in liquidation;

·         the number of complaints from the third sector about the way grants have been administered and the occasions where three months’ notice in advance of the termination of a contract was not given;

·         the number of cases included in the sample audit and the levels of non-compliance within that sample;

·         the 35 grants ended in 2013/14;

·         whether all of the Local Authorities are attending and contributing to Local Authority training provided by CIPFA (via WLGA) and Welsh Government/Welsh Audit Office; and

·         the £22 million-worth of hypothecated grant funding to the NHS.




4   Motion under Standing Order 17.42 to resolve to exclude the public from the meeting for the following business:

4.1     The motion was agreed.




5   National Framework for Continuing NHS Healthcare: Consideration of Draft Report

5.1     The Committee considered the draft report on Continuing NHS Healthcare and agreed a small number of changes.




6   NHS Waiting Times: Consideration of Welsh Government Response

6.1     The Committee considered the Welsh Government’s response to the Auditor General for Wales’ report on NHS Waiting Times and agreed to invite the Chair of a Community Health Council and a Health Board to provide oral evidence at a future meeting.


6.2     The Chair agreed to write to Dr Andrew Goodall to inquire about the timetable for implementing the agreed recommendations as set out in his letter.